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  1. #681
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Oppenheimer View Post
    I can certainly understand you like lavine and didnt want to see him go, but it takes something to get a player of butler's caliber.

    we were destined to have several holes to fill after last night with or without this trade. the difference here is that we just added a major piece to our core. that is critical in the NBA. we have time and money to fill the holes. the season doesnt start for months. some patience is in order. this trade was a major step in making us into a competitive team.
    I hope you're right Bob. I'd bet Towns, Wigs, Dieng and Bazz are bummed their buddy Zach was moved. Those guys were close. I hope Jimmy fits in the locker room. It's time to move on though. I'm all aboard. I can't wait to see a Wolves team we can be proud of. It's been so long.


  2. #682
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick K View Post
    I hope you're right Bob. I'd bet Towns, Wigs, Dieng and Bazz are bummed their buddy Zach was moved. Those guys were close. I hope Jimmy fits in the locker room. It's time to move on though. I'm all aboard. I can't wait to see a Wolves team we can be proud of. It's been so long.
    they may be personally sad to see lavine go, but I am sure they are also excited to bring in so much talent. these guys are professionals. if they cant handle trades that make the team better, they are in the wrong business.


  3. #683
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick K View Post
    I hope you're right Bob. I'd bet Towns, Wigs, Dieng and Bazz are bummed their buddy Zach was moved. Those guys were close. I hope Jimmy fits in the locker room. It's time to move on though. I'm all aboard. I can't wait to see a Wolves team we can be proud of. It's been so long.
    Being buddies is nice. But having a guy with an edge that will push his teammates is even better.


  4. #684
    Patton's college coach:

    Creighton basketball coach Greg McDermott was in Brooklyn on Thursday night, celebrating with Justin Patton and his family, and took a few moments to make a big prediction:

    “His trajectory of improvement is as impressive as anyone I’ve ever coached,’’ McDermott said. “Without question his best basketball is ahead of him.”

    When Patton first walked through the door at Creighton, he weighed 204 pounds. He spent his redshirt season trying to get bigger and stronger. He was put on a 6,000-calories-per-day diet.

    As McDermott said: “He ate a lot. And when he was full, I made him eat some more.’’

    ...

    “He can really run the floor,’’ McDermott said. “Unbelievable hands. He’s rare in that he’s a big guy who can make plays on the move. He can dribble, and finish with a score or a pass. He’s become a good shooter. He has to get stronger. His body still needs to develop.’’

    But history shows he’ll do whatever it takes. It was his worth ethic that led to a freshman season during which he improved almost daily.

    “He didn’t have the stamina to play at this level at first, or the strength,’’ McDermott said. “But he concentrated on his strength and conditioning. And last season, he just kept getting better as the season went on. It was so fun to watch.’’
    In a post-draft interview with Minnesota media, Patton seemed confident. Talking about his interview with the Wolves at the draft combine, he said he talked so much the Wolves didn’t even have a chance to go over film on him.
    http://www.startribune.com/timberwol...ton/430267713/


  5. #685
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEvine View Post
    Being buddies is nice. But having a guy with an edge that will push his teammates is even better.
    Yep, LeBron went to South Beach to play with his two best buds...then abandoned them to go play with Irving when the team was better. KD wanted OKC to keep Green, so they obliged...then traded Green after KD was locked up tight. KD then had the opportunity to go play with his friend, and opted to get his ring instead.


  6. #686
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Oppenheimer View Post
    I dont understand how you would call the return for dunn "peanuts". Butler is an allstar in his prime with a couple very reasonable years left on his deal. thats not peanuts.

    my understanding is that there was never a deal for Lavine and dunn for butler. wasnt that our offer and the bulls countered with wiggins and dunn? I dont have any ill will towards lavine or dunn, but swapping them for a 2 way allstar player like butler is a no brainer.

    I also dont see any logic in how trading down from 7 to 16 is equal to a top 5 pick?!? its not even equal to a top 7 pick, since we traded that 7 pick but also got another pick back. maybe you meant to say it was similar to a top 15 pick.
    Probably not worth spending too much time on this because I think we are in agreement, but just to clarify, I was talking about the 7th pick in this draft being worth a lot more than the 7th pick last year given how much better this draft was compared to last. So IF the deal on the table last year was LaVine and Dunn, then that was a much better deal. I feel like both Bulls and Wolves agreed to reevaluate the trade this summer.

    I was shocked that the bulls valued LaVine so highly. My guess is that we offered Wigs and Dunn or LaVine Dunn and pick swap and the Bulls took the LaVine option.

    My point about Dunn was that I doubt he was a significant piece in this trade. My guess is that we could have kept Dunn if we let the bulls keep their pick at 16. Dunn probably was the value that got us the 16...so not peunuts, especially in this draft, but Patton is a high ceiling development project that I don't like the idea of given that there were players available that you could easily see could make an impact in the NBA right away and help us out with needs.
    The sun shines again in Golden State as the hungry Wolves remain poised for the night to come


  7. #687
    Quote Originally Posted by rackshaq View Post
    Probably not worth spending too much time on this because I think we are in agreement, but just to clarify, I was talking about the 7th pick in this draft being worth a lot more than the 7th pick last year given how much better this draft was compared to last. So IF the deal on the table last year was LaVine and Dunn, then that was a much better deal. I feel like both Bulls and Wolves agreed to reevaluate the trade this summer.

    I was shocked that the bulls valued LaVine so highly. My guess is that we offered Wigs and Dunn or LaVine Dunn and pick swap and the Bulls took the LaVine option.

    My point about Dunn was that I doubt he was a significant piece in this trade. My guess is that we could have kept Dunn if we let the bulls keep their pick at 16. Dunn probably was the value that got us the 16...so not peunuts, especially in this draft, but Patton is a high ceiling development project that I don't like the idea of given that there were players available that you could easily see could make an impact in the NBA right away and help us out with needs.
    you are certainly entitled to speculate, but I feel like you are breaking this trade up into various parts with no real factual basis.

    view the trade as a whole. there were no peanuts exchanged here. we assembled a package of young talent and acquired an allstar in his prime. that was the deal. its not levine and the pick for butler and dunn for 16. look at the whole picture.


  8. #688
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Oppenheimer View Post
    you are certainly entitled to speculate, but I feel like you are breaking this trade up into various parts with no real factual basis.

    view the trade as a whole. there were no peanuts exchanged here. we assembled a package of young talent and acquired an allstar in his prime. that was the deal. its not levine and the pick for butler and dunn for 16. look at the whole picture.
    Looking at the whole picture, it was a good deal for both teams. Butler wasn't working out there and had to be traded while he still had 2 years on contract and significant value. The thing I was bringing up was the difference between what was talked about in a trade last year vs. this year. If the rumors had any validity last year, it tells you something about how much Dunn's value dropped over the course of his rookie season. Not taking "windows" into account, Butler loses value when you only get 2 years compared to 3, and that on top of Markkanen having more value than Dunn did right out of the gates, tells you a lot about Dunn's value. That's all I'm bringing up. Thibs failed on his first talent evaluation, that's the point. I like Thibs a lot and think he is one of the best coaches in the league as far as intelligence, but I want the record to show that his first attempt at talent evaluation was not a success by any strech of the imagination.
    The sun shines again in Golden State as the hungry Wolves remain poised for the night to come


  9. #689
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    Quote Originally Posted by rackshaq View Post
    Looking at the whole picture, it was a good deal for both teams. Butler wasn't working out there and had to be traded while he still had 2 years on contract and significant value. The thing I was bringing up was the difference between what was talked about in a trade last year vs. this year. If the rumors had any validity last year, it tells you something about how much Dunn's value dropped over the course of his rookie season. Not taking "windows" into account, Butler loses value when you only get 2 years compared to 3, and that on top of Markkanen having more value than Dunn did right out of the gates, tells you a lot about Dunn's value. That's all I'm bringing up. Thibs failed on his first talent evaluation, that's the point. I like Thibs a lot and think he is one of the best coaches in the league as far as intelligence, but I want the record to show that his first attempt at talent evaluation was not a success by any strech of the imagination.
    #5 is never going to "equal" Dunn. Just like trading a future first for Payne did not net us the value of a future first. #1 overall was not the same "value" as Wiggins. GMs want to be able to make their choice. It's like a new car. The moment you sign on the dotted line, the value depreciates.



 

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